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New Chaos Codex

Discussion not related to the 40k datafiles, or anything else in particular.

What do you think of the new codex?

It kicks ass!
6
25%
I like some of it, dislike other parts but it has potential
12
50%
Overall disappointed with it but has some things I like
5
21%
Sucks more than words can express!
1
4%
 
Total votes : 24

#16  Postby Tactica » Thu Oct 11, 2007 6:24 pm

Wraithlord wrote:Here is a list I am thinking of trying out. Mostly Tzeentch themed but with a bit of hired help :)

1 Daemon Prince
Bolt of Change; Mark of Tzeentch; Warptime

Wings?

1 Chaos Sorceror
Lash of Submission; Mount of Slaanesh; Personal Icon; Mark of Slaanesh

Why give him a mount that moves 6 and fleets 6 instead of shooting (spell casting)... why not give him a bike for the same cost? That way you can move 12" and still cast or zip 24" and become invulnerable and forgo casting? What's the point of mount over bike?

5 Terminators
Icon of Tzeentch

What's your weapon load out?

8 Thousand Sons
1 Aspiring Sorceror
Warptime, Meltabombs
1 Rhino

8 Thousand Sons
1 Aspiring Sorceror
Warptime, Meltabombs
1 Rhino

Units will not be able to deal with armor or high toughness beasties (c'fexes) really well. Force weapons are good, but only if you can wound with them first. I LOVE warptime, but I'd recomend bolt of change on the sorcerers in Tsons units as you have a limited amount of armor busting in this list.

9 Khorne Berzerkers
1 Skull Champion
Power Weapon; Meltabombs

I think this list would be better serveed by Emp's kids or Plague Marines. Emp's kids can shoot well, the sonic blaster is AMAZING, and Init 5 in this list could be valued. The Plague marines have T5 and feel no pain. The Powerfist buried in such a unit can toll out the damage. Blight gernades are the perfect counter to anything faster than them.

3 Obliterators

Just a good unit - solid choice.

1 Land Raider

Interesting that you chose this considering the limited firepower in the list. I assume you chose this as a delivery tool for the termy's though.

1 Defiler @ 150 Pts
Dreadnought CCW (x2)

Total Roster Cost: 2003

Its a good piece, but it may get torn up early. Considering you used a LR as a heavy, I'd probably prefer this to be a predator or more obliterators in my list. The single blast can be silenced relatively easy since it needs LOS to the target now. I'd consider it for my 3rd heavy if I wasn't running a LR as a heavy, but in this list, it doesn't feel like its the most desirable choice if you are looking to optimize.


Oh and btw Chunky a friend of mine plays Khorne and has for several years now and he LOVES the new berzerkers. Just thinking they kick ass even without the movement and chainaxes.

Furious charge is good, but its tough to get them to grips if the enemy is trying to avoid them. So you are using Rhinos or LR for delivery. That means, you have to take other targets for the enemy to fire at. If he's popping your rhinos, you could be in trouble if all you have is KB's. Thus, the need to run the heavy support and LR so - SOMETHING gets to grips early. More threats are a good thing.

Cheers,

Tac
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#17  Postby Wraithlord » Fri Oct 12, 2007 4:06 am

Tactica wrote:
Wraithlord wrote:Here is a list I am thinking of trying out. Mostly Tzeentch themed but with a bit of hired help :)

1 Daemon Prince
Bolt of Change; Mark of Tzeentch; Warptime

Wings?


Yes

1 Chaos Sorceror
Lash of Submission; Mount of Slaanesh; Personal Icon; Mark of Slaanesh

Why give him a mount that moves 6 and fleets 6 instead of shooting (spell casting)... why not give him a bike for the same cost? That way you can move 12" and still cast or zip 24" and become invulnerable and forgo casting? What's the point of mount over bike?


I am a big fan of the 12" charge over the 12" movement. Max distance with a bike is 18" and you don't get the +1 attack that a steed give. Max movement with a steed is 24" if you need it. I generally keep this guy back behind other units so I don't get him shot at too soon but I want him to be able to move forward and attack in cc quickly if I need it. I think that a daemonic steed is just a bit more versatile than a bike.

5 Terminators
Icon of Tzeentch

What's your weapon load out?


Basic loadout. I like terms to focus on cc for the most part anyway and as they all have pweapons already I don't feel the need to upgrade them usually.

8 Thousand Sons
1 Aspiring Sorceror
Warptime, Meltabombs
1 Rhino

8 Thousand Sons
1 Aspiring Sorceror
Warptime, Meltabombs
1 Rhino

Units will not be able to deal with armor or high toughness beasties (c'fexes) really well. Force weapons are good, but only if you can wound with them first. I LOVE warptime, but I'd recomend bolt of change on the sorcerers in Tsons units as you have a limited amount of armor busting in this list.


Definitely the weakness of the Tsons. I am hoping that the Oblits and such are able to take up the slack enough that if I have to use a force weapon vs a MC it will be a last case scenario.

9 Khorne Berzerkers
1 Skull Champion
Power Weapon; Meltabombs

I think this list would be better serveed by Emp's kids or Plague Marines. Emp's kids can shoot well, the sonic blaster is AMAZING, and Init 5 in this list could be valued. The Plague marines have T5 and feel no pain. The Powerfist buried in such a unit can toll out the damage. Blight gernades are the perfect counter to anything faster than them.


Tried these last night and was not overly impressed with them. Better than a basic marine in cc but not as effective as they were with the chainaxes.

3 Obliterators

Just a good unit - solid choice.

1 Land Raider

Interesting that you chose this considering the limited firepower in the list. I assume you chose this as a delivery tool for the termy's though.


Was going to use it for that or for the Berzerkers. Not sure now though if I will keep the Khorny's

1 Defiler @ 150 Pts
Dreadnought CCW (x2)

Total Roster Cost: 2003

Its a good piece, but it may get torn up early. Considering you used a LR as a heavy, I'd probably prefer this to be a predator or more obliterators in my list. The single blast can be silenced relatively easy since it needs LOS to the target now. I'd consider it for my 3rd heavy if I wasn't running a LR as a heavy, but in this list, it doesn't feel like its the most desirable choice if you are looking to optimize.


Just fit the points basically. After a test run I found this list to be just a tad too un-Tzeentchy for me with the Oblits, Slaanesh Sorc, and the Berzerkers. The only unit though that really bothers me is the Khorne Berzerkers as they just stand out from the whole theme too much. Oblits can be justified as Dark Mechanicus Adepts with unknown warp powers (that just happen to match up with weapon profiles :D) and the Slaanesh sorc IS a spellcaster already which would fit right in with the Tzeentch/magic theme. Berzerkers though? Can't really think of a justification that sounds right to me as they are very 'in your face' and straightforward and that isn't what Tsons are about in my mind.

This list is going to change shortly.
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#18  Postby Tactica » Fri Oct 12, 2007 11:28 pm

So perhaps swap out your zerkers for an elite unit of chosen with mark of Tz to keep the theme. Then don't forget to include the 4x your favorite power (weapon / fist) complimnet. That should give you the hand to hand you need and a champion to boot.

If you want to keep the LR, you can put the elites in there and they will still perform the intended zerker role.

Just a thought,

Tac
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#20  Postby jlong05 » Mon Dec 31, 2007 8:39 pm

I am not sure about the Chaos side of things, but you can always continue to play a Black Templar or Blood Angel or Dark Angels army using the SM codex and assigning your own traits that fit the style you want. You would just need to make it clear what you are doing to your opponents who may not know.

Just my thoughts.
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#21  Postby Chunky_Baby » Fri Feb 01, 2008 8:25 pm

Sorry if the threads a little old - just making it back.

I'm basically refusing to play Chaos until the new 'Dex comes out - and then I'll check in the store if there are new rules for the 'Serkers.

If none - I'm selling Chaos.

I agree Furious Charge is ok - it's a nice to have. But getting them there is now half the issue.

Sure - I can pump them in transports - but half, no - all the time - they'll get shot to crap.

I honestly can't think of anything that I'd want my opponent to shoot at instead.

Also - transports really limit your squad sizes - it was half of what made them great in the first place. Hard squads - rushing across the board on foot at a good pace.

I just can't see them sitting patiently in a Rhino.. just doesn't make sense.

Now that they are slow - they are useless to walk. Totally useless.
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#22  Postby Wraithlord » Sat Feb 02, 2008 6:21 pm

I have to agree that Berzerkers took a hit with the new codex. Same with IW and AL and the loss of their special rules.
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#23  Postby Col_Stone » Sat Feb 02, 2008 8:11 pm

I use the old codex for my World eaters, i won't be taking them to any tournaments but i can't stand the way they're treated in the new dex..
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#24  Postby Fyrebyrd » Sat Feb 02, 2008 8:50 pm

You know I honestly hope that IA6 has rules for the marked dreadnoughts. Its kinda funny that anyone with a specially armed/marked dread has no use for it right now...
My friend Chris is 50/50 on the new dex, he played Emperor's Children. He was angry about his slaanesh Dread getting canned, and his deamonettes getting the nerf. However he really likes the fact that he can now use raptors and obliterators.
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